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Phone Calls With Clever People

Shane Michael Hatton



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A raw and unexpected conversation on mental health with Alicia McKay

• 46 min

We're Talking About Mental Health.    Trigger warning: for anyone that may want to avoid this topic of conversation which includes discussion around anxiety, health, medication and depression.   My guest is one of New Zealand's most experienced and successful strategic facilitators Alicia McKay and she is known for tackling the tricky stuff in life, work and leadership.   When I invited Alicia to join me on the podcast our intention was to talk about her great new book 'You don't need an MBA'.   But as you'll quickly learn in this conversation, mental health doesn't discriminate and it can affect people who we might feel have it all together. Including Alicia and myself.   It may not have been the conversation we planned, but it was just the conversation that was needed.   Alicia has worked with New Zealand and Australia’s most senior leaders in government, business and community, injecting fresh perspective and sharp insight.   She has recently released her second book 'You Don't Need an MBA - Leadership lessons that cut through the crap' because she believes that gone are the days of sitting in a lecture hall every weekend for years, only to find that everything you learned has become irrelevant. For decades, we’ve been training people to become managers and subject matter experts. But to have real impact in today’s fast-moving, connected world, you need a different set of skills. Skills they don’t teach you at business school.   Connect with Alicia Linkedin - Learn more about her work and program at - Get a copy of her latest book at -    Connect With Shane Connect with Shane on LinkedIn at or visit to learn more about his work.

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